Sustain Juno-G Problem

[BHB4Music]

I have a problem with my Juno_G

If I release the sustain-pedaal, then sometimes my new played notes stop too, including all the effects. (Real silence)

It happens at least 1x/minute.

I have used several pedals.

[V-CeeOh]

I don't get it. You mean you have a cyclic silence in every minute after releasing the sustain pedal?


Could not afford the 8.
Listen to what I've done with the 7

[BHB4Music]

It's even very difficult to describe the problem in my own language, so now it's a real challenge. Let's try again.....

When I play piano for about 10 minutes it happens at least 10 times that my new played tones are killed when I release my sustain-pedal.
It's normal that the "old" tones fade out, but even the effects of that tones are killed. It's sounds like a reset. Like switching from one patch to another.
It's an annoying problem, because it sounds like a big gap between the several notes, especialy whene you're playing "slow strings".

[tompabes]

I HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM!!!

Finally I found somebody who noticed it... it looks like a software bug, but it is such an incredible bug that it seemed strange to me that nobody had noticed it...

I contacted Roland Italy, but they didn't know anything. Next week, I'll take give them the keyboard to have it repaired, but it looks like a software bug...

I've been investigating the bug for the whole week
Here's what I discovered (in my case):

1) the bug takes (more or less) one to threee minutes to happen. Just play using the pedal and it will happen in less than five minutes. All or almost all the notes you were playing will mute, including notes corresponding to keys that are currently down. The sound just stops. This makes the keyboard useless for any live application (seems like you are making mistakes! ).

2) to spot the bug: the bug is more evident if you are playing, say, strings parts than piano parts. E.g., keep a couple of keys down with left hand and play with right hand and pedal. In some minutes, all notes, including the keys you are keeping down, will mute.

3) the problem happens only when you are using the sustain pedal, so it cannot be a keyboard hw problem

4) if you record what you play using the song recorder and then watch the recorded notes, you will notice that notes have actually been interrupted like a note off message has been received

5) it happens both with patches and performances

6) if you look, in performance mode, at the keyboard at the bottom of the display that shows you the notes you are playing in realtime, when the problem happens the keys are not shown as pressed, even if they are

7) the bug does not happen if you play the Juno-G via midi with another keyboard, but if you play another keybord using the Juno, the bug happens on the other keyboard!!!

8) I also tried more than one kind of sustain pedal (including a Boss FH5) and the happened with all pedals

So what?
It can't be a polyphony problem, and does not look like an hardware problem...
To me, it is a bug in the sustain pedal controller/handler or whatever... maybe an hardware bug or a software bug...

Anyway, we must find a way to solve it, otherwise the keyboard cannot be used in live performances (I cannot risk a keyboard mute while I'm playing a solo string part with a singer...).

BHB4Music: my email is tommasopaba at yahoo.com, let's stay in touch and see what we can do... better to reply on this forum, anyway, as maybe we'll contact other people with the same problem.

[V-CeeOh]

really weird. I'm gonna try it right away in the in-store Juno and I'll be back.


Could not afford the 8.
Listen to what I've done with the 7

[V-CeeOh]

Yes, it happens. This is a major problem, undoubtly.


Could not afford the 8.
Listen to what I've done with the 7

[tompabes]

Thanks fixthemix... and if it happens in three junos located in Italy, the Netherlands and Portugal we can be pretty sure that it is a production bug...

Now the point is how to understand if Roland is aware of the problem and if they plan to solve it... I'll try to talk again toRoland Italy...

[BHB4Music]

It's quite a relief that I'm not the only one with this problem.
I've send this problem to Roland Benelux for a week ago, but still no answer. I'll try again... I won't give up. It's a serious problem and on stage is a annoying bug. Like a cannot play.
I'm very curious how this ends and how Roland gonna fix this.

[Doktor Bro]

not funny looks like a memory overrun.

by the way, where is the thread for the bugs?

---------------------------------------------------
Event TR6, Mackie 1402-VLZ, Roland Juno G (SRX-98), SE Electronics 2200A, Waves Y96k, Yamaha AW2400, Yamaha PSR-220, Zoom SB-246

[tompabes]

Is there any Juno-G owner that does *NOT* have this bug?

I would like to understand if it is a problem in every Juno-G or only in a batch (like Junos coming from a given firm, or having a given hardware revision...).

If it were a software bug, it would clearly affect all Junos.
The fact that it is discovered only now could mean that there is only a faulty batch of Junos. It could be a hardware bug in some controller chip...

So I would kindly ask to every Juno-G owner that uses it with a sustain pedal: do you also have this bug?
Where and when did you buy your Juno?

@Doktor Bro: so I assume that you also have this problem?

@Artemio: if you read this thread, what do you think? Did you notice the bug in your Juno?

Thanks everybody. I'm trying to gather the more information I can before going to the service center.

[Artemiy]

I do not have a hold pedal so I can't check this yet, sorry.

[Doktor Bro]

I do not have a hold pedal too, sorry

---------------------------------------------------
Event TR6, Mackie 1402-VLZ, Roland Juno G (SRX-98), SE Electronics 2200A, Waves Y96k, Yamaha AW2400, Yamaha PSR-220, Zoom SB-246

[urtzurd]

Hi!

I checked it out last night at home, and the problem described also affects my unit. I live in Spain, so by the moment the problem seems to be located in Europe. I hadn't noticed it yet, because I play most of the time using my S90ES as controller.

I also noticed some weird things related to pedal and midi. When I use my S90ES as controller with it's sustain pedal, it only affects the notes played through midi. So, if i hold the pedal and play on the S90ES, the notes hold. If I add some notes on the Juno's keyboard, they dont't hold. ¿Is this normal? This is the first time I own two keyboards at the same moment

Another funny thing is that I can make monophonic voices sound 'duophonic'. The sound generator makes one monophonic voice with the notes played through midi, and another with the keys played through the keyboard. This way, I can play two notes simultaneously, each one responding to legato playing through it's notes source (keyboard and midi). ¿Should it work this way?

I hope the sustain issue will be addressed soon in an OS upgrade.

Best regards,
Urtzi.

[tompabes]

UPDATE: Today I went to a Service Center and left the keyboard there to have it repaired.

The technician said he thought it is really unlikely that it is a software bug. If it were a software bug, every Juno would be affected, and they would have known before.
I have to agree with him that it is a too big bug to pass through beta testing without notice...

He checked the Juno-G scheme, and said that there is a controller chip that handles all the controls (sustain and volume pedals, bend/modulation stick and so on), and he said that there could be a problem with that chip.

When I told him that other people from other european countries noticed this problem, he agreed that it could be a hardware problem that is present in a given batch.

Next week he will tell me something more. He will also contact Roland. I'll let you know when I have some news.

@urtzurd: so we have a faulty juno also in Spain... unless in this forum we are all europeans, the problem could be in a batch of Junos distributed in Europe.
Your S90 test is another good idea, but I don't know if, in that case, notes played on the Juno while you hold the pedal on the S90 should be held or not... Maybe it depends on some settings or midi implementation...

[starship]

I live in the US, and I bought Juno-G from the store first time brand new (Guitar Center), and it had that problem, I returned it and got another brand new Juno-G, and that has the same problem!!!

I tried 3 different pedals including Roland pedals for the 'Hold' input, and I keep getting the same problem!!!! The notes just cut off at random, and it sucks when I am playing sustained sounds live like Piano/Guitar.

I'm sure now its a software problem. Otherwise this would not be happening with all the Juno-Gs and with all the different pedals I am trying. I used these same pedals with a Yamaha Motif ES and a Korg Triton Extreme before and they never gave me this problem!!

Initially, I thought its a polyphony overload, so I turn off unnecessary tones, and sometimes even when I just start playing (say 16 notes of polyphony), it happens!

I played at my friend's wedding, and I got embarrased 5 times due to this! The audience thought its a flaw in my playing, so I had to make an announcement after the performance.

Roland has to give its users an update! I am surprised as someone said that not many complained about this problem!!!

PS:
Roland, while you are at it, how about giving users the option of a multi-sampling option and pattern sequencing options for the Juno-G (I would pay for it)