Moderators and Censorship

Questions related to Roland Clan site and forum
Still Learning
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Joined: 19:05, 14 September 2004
Location: Los Angeles

Moderators and Censorship

Post by Still Learning »

Hi Guys, This post is primarily for Artemio, Nathan, and Bassman. As you know I've been a contributor here for two years. This site is the Best-On-The-Web for all things relating to the Fantom keyboards. In those two years, I have never heard or seen evidence of you guys deleting threads or posts. There have been locked threads but I am disappointed to hear that you have been deleting them http://forum.fantomized.info/index.php? ... =19&page=1

This whole Perfect Piano situation is pretty crazy but it shouldn't be censored (i.e. deleting threads). There are two very prominent Internet Forums, Keyboard Magazine's Forum at http://www.musicplayer.com/cgi-bin/ulti ... /f/18.html and Harmony Central's Forum at http://acapella.harmony-central.com/for ... forumid=18 As you probably know, these forums are moderated by pretty well known people in the music industry, people like Dave Horne, Stephen Fortner, Ernie Rideout, Max Sidman, Ken Hughes, Dave Bryce, Michael Gallant, Martin Hines, etc. NONE of these guys have deleted any threads on this topic at their forums that haven't broken forum rules. (although they have asked their members to let this topic fade away).

There is proof that Mr. Coakley is modifying and deleting threads on his company's forum pages see here for proof

Mr. Coakley has viciously and cruelly attacked several well respected music Industry professionals on both a personal and professional level. This is fact and should not be censored.

Regardless of the topic, I cannot support the unilateral deletion of threads or posts that are not breaking forum rules. (i.e. profanity, libel, ad hominem personal attacks, etc.)

The very important concept that I think the three of you should really think about is this: Censorship of posts should not be invoked if the post does not break forum rules.

I am very interested in your views on this. I leave open the possibility that I'm missing something here, but I think all of the music industry professionals mentioned above are in the right regarding deciding not to delete threads that do not break forum rules.

Thanks for giving me the ability to post my views, and thanks (in advance) for not deleting this post!! :)

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Learning to play like Sponge Bob !
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V-CeeOh
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Re: Moderators and Censorship

Post by V-CeeOh »

Still
(If you care to know my opinion....)

I understand your worries but I think that you really missed something.
As far as I know, no one deleted Mr. Coakley's posts. bassman deleted posts from a "oniram" member wich I think most of us haven't read, so we can't say the posts breaked or not forum rules. Anyway, as bassman said the purpose of deleting the above mentioned post was to not let Fantomized be used as a "revenge tool" by other forums members - meaning, bring other forums problems into Fantomized.
I personally stand by them about this.
Regards


o - ...just could not afford the 8
(
\_/
hear what I've done with the 7
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Artemiy
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Re: Moderators and Censorship

Post by Artemiy »

We will get over this, but those threads indeed were "ad hominem personal attacks", that is why they got deleted. There is now a threat that the flame from other forums can also fall on us, why would we need this? I do not see any reason why we should let those guys to just come to our forum and continue the trash they have on their forums.

As about those "famous" guys (whose names I hear for the first time... really ;-)), they may not be doing a thing because they are too many posts to moderate and they are just... lazy ;-) Just kidding of course, no offence to those guys.

BTW, the piano-related threads were NOT deleted but moved to the third-party section.

The only thing we're gonna do here is keep this place isolated from the Internet garbage, and I think we do it as politely and carefully as possible.


Artemiy.
Hobo
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Re: Moderators and Censorship

Post by Hobo »

Right on Art.
Still Learning
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Re: Moderators and Censorship

Post by Still Learning »

Hi Fix, thanks for the post. I fully understand the "revenge tool" concept and the concept of bringing other forum problems into Fantomized. I also understand that this whole situation is pretty ugly and really serves no purpose, BUT my simple point is that it shouldn't be censored. If forum rules were broken, then that should be explained. I would propose that the moderators leave the original offending message frame intact but simply replace the text within the frame with something like:
***the text of this post was deleted by moderator XXX for non-compliance with forum rules/policies on the use of profanity*** or something similar.

I do not understand the deletion of posts without a valid reason being provided. I do not feel that Fantomized should start censoring music industry related topics just because they are ugly, nasty, or unpopular.

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Learning to play like Sponge Bob !
ncsteff
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Joined: 23:28, 27 January 2005

Re: Moderators and Censorship

Post by ncsteff »

In my opinion, our moderators are some of the most level-headed, dignified, and fair-minded individuals that I have encountered in any internet forum. I support them wholeheartedly.

I spend very little time on some of the other forums mentioned, and have been disapponted by either their content, tone, or both almost every time I have visited. Fantomized (and Artemio's related sites) is/are among the few mature, intelligent, thoughtful and calm discussion forums uncluttered by "non-information noise" or diluted by excessive way-off-any-musical-topic digressions.

Please, let's not descend to the level of these other forums by bringing their stench into our living room.

Still Learning, you clearly have very strong peronal opinions and feelings about a certain other contributor to this forum, but with all due respect I wish you would take your vendetta to one of the "other" forums.

Respectfully,

** ncsteff **
Fantom X8 and XR, and too many SRXs
Now if I only had the time ...
Still Learning
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Re: Moderators and Censorship

Post by Still Learning »

Thanks for the reply Artemio, I will accept your explanation that the deleted posts were ad hominem in nature and I'm sure that you verified that with Nathan regarding the two threads that he recently deleted.

I treasure the concept of Free Speech (as I'm sure you do also) and I am just a little concerned that the moderators here were censoring posts without providing explanations.

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Learning to play like Sponge Bob !
Still Learning
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Re: Moderators and Censorship

Post by Still Learning »

Hi ncsteff, As God is my witness, I honestly don't know what you are talking about. I have absolutely no idea who you are refering to with your "other contributor" comment. I have no vendetta, please do not attack my character without some form of proof.

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Learning to play like Sponge Bob !
ncsteff
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Re: Moderators and Censorship

Post by ncsteff »

Still Learning,
I certainly did not intend to "attack your character," and please accept my apology if you feel I have done so. "Vendetta" was perhaps too strong a word. I simply meant that you seem to have strong antipathy to Mr. Coakley and it, well, comes through in your posts on this topic ... in the tone, as well as the amount of time you clearly spent composing the initial post in this thread. I have nothing but the highest regard for your character, as much of it as I have discerned through your presence on this forum.

** ncsteff **
Fantom X8 and XR, and too many SRXs
Now if I only had the time ...
Still Learning
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Re: Moderators and Censorship

Post by Still Learning »

thanks, ncsteff...

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Learning to play like Sponge Bob !
William Coakley
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editing posts

Post by William Coakley »

Actually those "other" forums do edit threads. The whole last half of my session there got deleted... especially the part about the administrators part in a programming error in the Kurzweil 1000.

I think this site is unique and I'm quite confident that it will remain so.

William

williamcoakley.com
Still Learning
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Re: Moderators and Censorship

Post by Still Learning »

Dear Fantomized moderators, I ask a little latitude here regarding this post. I have atempted to take this away from the Fantomized board but I have been unsuccessful. Please see below.

Hi William, I just tried to post on your forum but was unsuccessful. Your forum seems to be closed to new members. At least I could not find a way to join. Anyway, since you are monitoring this thread here at Fantomized, I would appreciate if you could address the following two questions.

Hi William, Can you please explain 2 things for me?
1) you recently posted on Fantomized the following:
"Actually those "other" forums do edit threads. The whole last half of my session there got deleted... especially the part about the administrators part in a programming error in the Kurzweil 1000. " Could you please provide some proof of this or at the very least provide the link to the page that was edited?

and 2) Could you please explain why you have edited other peoples posts on your forum? Specifically, could you explain why you modified Dave Horns post? His discription of this event can be found at http://acapella.harmony-central.com/for ... genumber=1

Thank for your time and attention to these questions.

P.S. Could you please provide specific instructions as to how new members can join your forum?

Thanks, Mr. Coakley

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Learning to play like Sponge Bob !
sambasevam
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Re: Moderators and Censorship

Post by sambasevam »

Are you still trying to talk to him?

He lives in his own special world....he edits things to say something stupid like "You came out vinally and you are gay. " Acts more like a 12-year old, me thinks.



Give it up, this guy wants more and more product advertisement, so, the more we keep talking about this garbage, the more he gains....


just so that he doesnt get away with his false claims : His take on the kurz programming was BS. The guy who worked in the kurz department HIMSELF said it that those kurz products were different and still, he goes around spreading his false words everywhere....However, marino said that there was some very basic programming, still not anywhere close to what mr.C described.

Mr.C, MANY people just dont like your product cos there are tons of better stuff than yours. Why cant you live with it? BTW, your post on consulting the FBI to catch Dave is incredibly humorous. Technically, he should be suing you....




---------------------------------------------------------------
If at first you dont suceed, then skydiving is definitively not for you.
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dboulden
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Re: Moderators and Censorship

Post by dboulden »

Really guys... can we PLEASE just let this one die.

:o|

Dave

http://www.drstudio.demon.co.uk/
"Musicians fall into three categories: those with a physical block, those with a mental block and those with a wooden block". Unfortunately, I'm in the 1st category!
nsheldon
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Re: Moderators and Censorship

Post by nsheldon »

Hi all.

I agree with Dave. People, if you have a problem with one of our members, take your problems off-line.

sambasevam: Comments like "He lives in his own special world....he edits things to say something stupid like "You came out vinally and you are gay. " Acts more like a 12-year old, me thinks." are personal attacks and are inappropriate for a public forum. Please refrain.

Still Learning: We all appreciate your contributions and your concerns about our Fantomized forum and community. Allow me to expand on what Artemio said. I personally don't like deleting posts or entire threads if at all possible. The threads "oniram" started were posted in multiple sections, but more importantly, they were designed to continue a flame war started on Harmony Central here on Fantomized. That's something that this community doesn't need. Public disagreements are fine. Public personal attacks are not. I stand by my decision to remove those flame-inviting threads. Thanks again for your concern and input.

Regards,

Nathan Sheldon
http://www.nathansheldon.com/
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