Just another RANT from a loyal Roland Guy

[jmoss501]

Now that I think about Roland will never put a fantom-X sound set and 4srx in mv-8800. Doing that would for ever kill the fantom-x and what ever comes out in the future.
Well maybe not kill it, but definitely hurt it. All of us Hip-Hop and R&B and Dance music producers would definitely gravitate to the Fantom MV.

Sometimes I do miss the days of the midi nightmares life was easy back then.

MC-50 sequencing/JV-80 or XP 10/30/60/80 sounds/S-760 sampling/RY-30 or Mpc drums/Tascam 8-track vocals plus a shit load of midi cables and a midi patch bay

We were forced to use what we had and there was no all-in-one machines. We were more productive, at least I was. I sold all of my old hardware thinking the fantom-s was answer to all my problems. They(Roland/Yamaha/Korg) keep coming out with new gear so fast with new exciting capabilities. We have all, well a least I have become a gear junkie. Man you should see the stack of manuals from all of the Roland keyboards and workstation I have purchased over the last 15 years. I do, really do want a ROLAND all-in-one machine that does everything well basses,pianos,strings,pads,horns,synths and most of all Drums for god sake Drums. Not the ones they keep giving us from old BabyFace albums that are so light in the ass you have to stack them Sears Tower high to get the woofer to move.

Thats why you keep hearing all the MPC talk from people. The Mpc is prehistoric as far as capabilities. But it does move the woofers. Most people hear are right, the X does have it all and more. I don't think that there is anyone here who has truly mastered it yet. But Roland wont let us or give us enough time to. They keep rolling out new Keyboards every two or three years. They always make it their point to leave out some feature we have grown to love or they leave out something that make no since to leave out because its the norm to have it in a workstation (life 3mfx for each track like the Motifs). No I dont want a Motif, I'm a Roland dude for life. Which might be the problem most of us are Roland dudes and we tend to be very loyal to Roland. I think they know that about us, WE ARE LOYAL to a fault. What the hell am I ranting for, I really don't know. When Roland drops a new Workstation I'm sure I will be drooling all over it and diggin in my wallet for my DEBIT card to by it. (notice I did'nt say credit card). AND I'm sure I and you will find something we wish they had not left out. Then we will log in to tell everyone about it.

I will eventually get the X and give my wife my Debit card. I will master that board in about 10years before I give Roland another dime.

Somebody just please tell Roland to come out with a Srx card dedicated to DRUMZ and Not Drums. I lived in Japan for three years working in the music industry. They don't really understand what DRUMZ are, at least the ones that work at Roland don't. So someone please tell Mike Acosta to fly over there before they drop the next Fantom. Tell MIke to tell them to delete the Drums they are going to use for the new Fantom dash whatever. Make them start over and get the Drums/Drumz right, once and for all. No more recycling JV and XP drums from 1992. It's 2007 for God sake, B-BOYZ need love too. OR now check this out, Go steal the guy who does the Drums/Drumz for the Yamaha Motif's and pay him what ever the hell he wants.

OH yeah 80GIG HD thats 5 times faster than the one Alesis uses for the Fusion. Also give us the pads from the MV-8800.
In additon tell my wife to leave me alone when I doing my music thang. She does not listen to me she American and Black.

One more thing Roland, at least pretend your listening to us. I do spend more time playing with your gear than do playing with my wife and my wife is fine as hell on any standard.

Truly Sincere, THE ROLAND GUY ;-}

[Quinnx.]

I think if they ever bring out the next real workstation roland will be starting to look like old farts from yesteryear if it does not include the following..

External usb/storage connectivity
a real file managment system that organises songs and samples as independat projects (See Fx FileSystem MasterClass below)
Believe it or not the V synth has the a files system which the fantom should have had, saving everything as Projects in seperate folders.

at least 256 poly
some independant EQ per track/channel
more advanced samplng editiing features to compete with pc versions.

multitasking.. (have you ever tryed to do more than 1 task at a time on the X)
you get errors like NOW PLAYING when you try to go somewhere else.
or if in performance mode you move to another channel and the sample loop you where playing stops?
in pattern mode moving down the list stops the previous pattern from playing.
and so on..
it seems if you try to do more than on task on the X your music just STOPS!
Any way...
These are just some BASIC things that need to change
but As i keep saying, roland are a business first and are not going to release anything that will kill there current line of products, so i dont see an all in one killer machine comming any time in the early 21st century, maybe wait till we get closer to the 22nd then roland will have finaly release so many combinations of synth/workstation that they will have even more old technology they can repackage as new AGAIN.


Listen to GlassSlipper


X-Bugs.org

Results not Excuses

My Setup


- -

[thunderkyss]

1st, we say we need something that does more than the FantomX currently does. Then we point to the success of the MPC, which does less than the Fantom as an example of what Roland needs to do.

I'm confused.

QuinX, I'm with you. The Fantom should have been able to host at least a USB Harddrive, and a per project filing system should have been part of the Fantom-S.. they missed it, no big deal, but it makes absolutely no sense not to include it on the X.

As far as the 256 poly goes, I think the FantomX is already overpowered, with it's 16 track 128 poly architecture now. Either give me more insert effects(a per channel EQ would be a nice start), or give me two more stereo pairs to get my music out.

Or let me stream my music out over firewire/USB2.0....

I'm happy with my Fantom-S, & I love my daughter's X8. But just like every other machine, it has limitations that keep it from being the perfect machine for me.

I just don't understand why "Loyal" Roland users complain sooooo much, about what they can't do, instead of getting on with what they can do.

FantomX8
FantomS
AW4416
Now all I need is talent.
Anyone selling any talent??
member # 55
registered 21 May 2003

tundrkys98@yahoo.com Yahoo messenger: tundrkys98

[Audissey]

he is saying that the MPC has better quality, (for lack of better word) phatter drums. also, the feel and i would say the groove / swing quantize in the MPC is hard to duplicate. each piece of equipment has a different purpose. i use my MPC-1000 to do drums / percussion ONLY. i use my fan X for sounds only and i sequence in pro tools. in the near future, i dont see ANY one coming out with a machine that does it all cause realistically, its stupid business wise. i mean, if everyone had one machine and it did it all, why would they ever have to buy a new machine? i mean, it would be great for us but not so good for the corp. and unfortunately as much as they deny it, it aint so much about the consumer as much as it is about the MONEY.

o o o o o o o o o o o o o

Fantom-X6, Juno-D, Edirol Pcr M-80
Reggae, RnB, Hip Hop, Funk Keyboardist
Roland Junkie
Coming Soon: Fantom-XR

[jmoss501]

Audissey you are hit it on head. I just realized that also, Thats like making a car that runs on a tank of gas forever or like a cure for diseases. There is no money in the cures for everyday problems. The money is in the treatment.

They will never make us completely happy. We all have to just realize that and just use whatever they give us to use.

They want us to buy the Fantom and the MV.
Combing the two into a fantom MV would cost them a lot of money.

They don't want us to buy new gear from them every 5 to 10 years. They want us to buy new gear from them every 2 or 3 years. It's about money for them and not about our wants and needs.

Then Fantom-X is a machine thats perfect if you use it with a computer and a DAW.

OpenLabs is start to sound better and better to me now that I think about it. If they would include a dedicated sequencer built directly into the MIKO or NIKO, sorry Roland but I would be outta here.

THE ROLAND GUY

[Artemiy]

"he is saying that the MPC has better quality, (for lack of better word) phatter drums"

1. Yes, I thought so as well, but their pads turned to be too hard to get triggered accurately: if you miss the very center, you get low velocity or no sound triggered at all. Wonderful! Even those "crappy" Fantom-X pads are easier to work with.

2. MPCs do not come with much pre-loaded sounds, what drums are you talking about? Get a sample CD from guys like Ueberschall and you will get uber-phat sounds on any gear.

[jmoss501]

Artemio, thats what I do, I'm not a DJ anymore but I spend a lot of time diggng in the crates for drums. I dont mind that at all it's kinda part of the process thats makes it fun.

But how long is Roland going to keep recycling Drums from the JV series from 1992. I will tell you how long until we make them update them. Or a least let them know were not happy with them.

I'm not a MPC fan at all. The MPC is like a people with Autism, they tend to struggle with a lot of normal things. But they are usually exceptionally good a one thing or another. The crappy filters the MPC uses does make Drums sound good and thick.

The Drums in the motif are way better than what Roland puts in the Fantom. All I'm saying to Roland is "step ya game up" in that department. It needed to said, so I said it.

We all as musicians and producers spend all of time time trying to be and get better than we were last year with our musical and production skills. Thats whats it all about, to get and be better at whatever we do.

Roland needs some tutoring or on it Drums/Drumz game.
We all love Roland for what they do and have done with their line of gear over the years. But as consumers of their products we have the right to demand better. Companies like Prepellerhead, Cakewalk and Ableton do a great job of reading forums and listening to their customers input then incorporating some of the requests and changes in their products. I never have gotten that feeling from Roland. Hell I may be wrong. it's just the impression I get.

I have been reading this forum for years and we all have complained about the Drums over the years. But still no changes. Is it better to say something or say nothing?
I'm just saying it now before they release the new workstation. Because after they release it, it's to late, were stuck with it again.

I love to verbal banter with my Yamaha and Korg users. But when we get to drums I always lose. I HATE losing!@#$%^&*.

THE ROLAND GUY

[Audissey]

well, my MPC had some kits in it and i got an AKAI cd for it, and every single drum sound was better than any drum sound in my fan x. on the other hand, i rarely use the akai drums, i make reggae and r&b / hip hop so i bought Sly Dunbar's Drumsplash. sometimes i layer 2-5 kicks and snares together to get a punchier, tighter or deeper / phatter kick or snare. realistically, if you just layer sounds in the fan x, you can achieve some nice drum sounds, but i have those drums in my fan x also but for some reason, they sound better coming out of my MPC. also, the pads on the MPC feel alot better to me than the fantoms pads and i would rather play pads than keys for my drums.

also, i must say, the drums in the fantom sound better than my old triton extreme...gotta get that one out.

as for the Motif, the sounds on the motif are the most realistic (as far as strings and winds and of course drums). i do have the entire motif drum library on my computer and sometimes i'll use it in my MPC but even then, i gotta layer a couple different drums to get that "phat" sound that makes a track.

what i see as far as an all in one solution, is 100% DAW sequencing with the fantom or triton or motif offered as a VST and using a usb / midi controller like the akai one with the integrated pads and keyboard. but i dont think too many hardware junkies are gonna like that idea. thats almost where i'm at. i have a BUNCH of vst's and sometimes i wont even use the hardware for a song. just vst's and my edirol pcr-m80 as a midi controller.

its probably never gonna happen, the whole all in one with great sounds and a great sequencer piece of hardware. as much as it would help us as producers, it will probably be too costly to create for roland or any other manufacturer to even consider producing. i mean, if the great workstation we are complaining about is already ofer 2G's, imagine one that incorporates a 2,000 workstation with a 2,000 groove machine. it would be well over 5,000 dollars. i mean, to some, thats affordable, but that is ALOT of money for one piece of production equipment. cmon now, what makes sense about that. oh well. another day goes by and we just gotta "suffer" with what we got.

my fingers are getting sore. lol!

o o o o o o o o o o o o o

Fantom-X6, Juno-D, Edirol Pcr M-80
Reggae, RnB, Hip Hop, Funk Keyboardist
Roland Junkie
Coming Soon: Fantom-XR

[jmoss501]

Well fellow Roland peeps. I had the answer to my problem all along. It came to me about a year ago. I mean it came like a thousand watt light bulb floating over my head it did. After reading all of your follow up to my post. The genius I rarely display came back to me like a old long lost female friend with the really nice ass and no attachments from my non-married days.

Drum Roll!@#$%^&*!@#$%^@#$%^@#$%^

The MIKO and a MV-8000 or MV- 8800

MIKO= The perfect sound module all the sounds and vst I can steal which I have already done. You name it I got it over 200gigs worth and still downloading. Plus a full functioning DAW running LIVE 6 or Sonar both I have already learned. Its the perfect Sound module plus DAW, all in one unit.

MV-8000/MV-8800=DRUMZ,Sequencing and Sampling
No need to explain that. Nuf said.


It will cost me $4500 dollars all together. That will be money well spent. Because that setup will hold me for a long time 5-10 years.

What we are asking the Roland to put in the Fantom's. Open Labs has done it already with the NIKO and MIKO.

I will get a used MV-8000 cost about $1100 (thats what I see them on Ebay for)

MIKO with the specs I want $3500.

Total $4500 for both units

Thats just one week worth of salary

Thanks Guys problem solved.

THE ROLAND GUY

[Audissey]

glad you've found your solution. i'm gonna stick to mine

o o o o o o o o o o o o o

Fantom-X6, Juno-D, Edirol Pcr M-80
Reggae, RnB, Hip Hop, Funk Keyboardist
Roland Junkie
Coming Soon: Fantom-XR

[thunderkyss]

It's only been recently, that hip-hop "producers" have been into keyboard instruments. Most likely because very few keyboard instruments included a sampler.

I'm sure Roland is thrilled, that hip-hop "producers" are getting into their Keyboards, as well as their rack units, and the new MV, but I'm sure Roland aims the Fantom at Songwriters, and performers.

My point, the Drums in the Fantom are fine for 98% of the people who buy Fantoms. of the 2% needing different drums, many find their answer in SRX cards, Vinyl, or sample CDs.

The ones who are still not satisfied will spend $4500(1 weeks salary) on a MEKO, only to still have the same problem.

FantomX8
FantomS
AW4416
Now all I need is talent.
Anyone selling any talent??
member # 55
registered 21 May 2003

tundrkys98@yahoo.com Yahoo messenger: tundrkys98

[triple-x]

wow, thunder , where do you work that your making 234K a year?

--------------------------------------------------
Cynical, pessimistic, sarcastic, and holding a low opinion of humanity.

[jmoss501]

Not with my music.

To answer your question
Insurance Sales(Health and Life), I'm an independent sales Rep.

THE ROLAND GUY

[Roccoto_]

J mos I have to agree with you on that one-- the filters on that raggity mpc 2000 some how sounds so sweet when it comes to drumz... Im taking a wild guess that the fantom filters are superb when it comes to synths....I mean I have the M3 and the sound sucks a$$ it doesnt come anywhere near to the fantom..so One day I decided to connect the m3 through midi into the fantom and I was blown away ...a little tweaking between my m3 and fantom stepped up my whole game up -----I dont think having an one and all workstation would be a great idea to begin with, it would just saturate the whole hip hop industry, everyone and their mothers would sound the same..What I do ask roland though is to come out wih something to compete with the Karma technology that joint is so sweet..Art you know what Im lking about ..I tried to use the arps on the fantom but it doesnt inspire me like the m3 does(you actually think for a seconds that a guitarist was included with the m3)---

Fantom X6, M3 Korg, Dig 002 Rack, Monitor K5, I- Mac Intel Processor (Dual Core)

[jmoss501]

Roccoto
Good Point on the ALL-in-ONE concept. Stuff would sound the same.

NIKO/MIKO ALL-in-ONE unit that you can customize with your own sounds, it eliminates sounding the same. PLus with the MV is the route I'm Going.


THE ROLAND GUY