TR-8 Fixes and features wishlist

[Happy]

Here i go with some things I found and recommendations. Don't get me wrong, the TR-8 is fantastic.

FIX REQUESTS:

[1] MIDI Real time messages
ALSA shows 2 Midi interfaces in Linux using USB. (amidi –l) The TR8 seems to sends real time (start/stop/clock/active sensing) messages, on only one interface (in this case 2,0.0) but not on the other (in this case 2.0.1). When using the MIDI OUT the real time messages ARE send. The manual does not tell the distinction between these two.

[2] Playback random tempo up/down
When the external USB to the host is connected AND there no connection made in the JACK/ALSA connection tool (i.e QJackctrl) the tempo (e.g. on headphone out) becomes intermittent (slows up and down randomly) This is not a major issue but a bit of an annoyance. After an applciation connects to one of the raw midi ports, the tempo returns to normal. This does not occur using the DIN MIDI OUT and only occurs in Windows 8 (with or w/ the driver loaded) when the PC boots up.

[3] Kick Drum sound reverb randomly cut off
When using high DECAY (> 50%) sometimes BD sound is cut short or a click is heard and it happens on random steps (play BD on all fours). The BD decay is sometimes missing. Also, when placing two BD after another (i.e. demo pattern 3) the 2nd BD is cut short.

[4] Note-On MIDI implementation
When using the USB MIDI and in playback mode, the TR8 sends a note on/off (and thus channel) command for each note (No running status used). However, on the DIN MIDI OUT it applies running status. This should not be an issue as long as the TR-8 does mix the incoming USB data it echo's when in running mode to the external MIDI OUT.

FEATURE REQUESTS:

[5] Scatter does not send CC messages
Scatter does not send CC so cannot record/playback to/from DAW

[6]External MIDI clock
USB is MIDI interface. When using the external MIDI device as master the display in the TR8 will show “----” (this is not mentioned in the manual and I first wondered what it meant). It would be nice to how “EXT” or something or even better to show the detected midi external clocks speed in BPM.

[7] Backup/Load Drum patterns.
It is not possible to backup or load one or more patterns. No SYSEX for single (current active) or single/multiple (stored memory dumps). Seen by many as a significant limitation.

[8] Volume on MIDI message
Note on and Note off always send 50h as volume. The TR-8 does not take the volume from the volume slider to send it over MIDI.

[9] Instrument mute
When in INST mute, can't see which instrument is playing. Perhaps use the instrument buttons to flash?

[10] External MIDI playback and indicators
When receiving playback data from MIDI, there is no indicator which of the sounds is played, perhaps the instrument select button could be used for this.

[11] 14 bit CC resolution
All controllers are 7 bit. The controller messages could use the MSB controller to send 14 bit resolution

[12] Allow copy pattern from bank A to B and B to A
This is not possible. This would be useful since often bank A and B are very similar patterns.

[13] Enable controller values playback
The TR-8 sends CC messages but when playback ignores these. Thus for example, Accent, Reverb, delay, comp and decay effects are not applied. This is a major limitation. An issue here could be the sync with the external device. Some effects in the Tr-8 allow having different settings for an effect per each step. A solution could be is to have the TR-8 set its step counter to 1 when receiving the MIDI real-time START message.

[14] Increase pattern storage
The patterns that can be saved are limited to 16. Perhaps it is possible to allow more patterns to be saved.

[15] Save parameters per pattern
The pattern saving does not save the settings of controller, volume, tempo etc. Selecting a pattern thus does not set the controllers, volume tempo etc.

[16] Add Parameter lock in T-REC mode
Be able to select and lock the Tune, Decay etcetera per each individual step

[17] Add Sound sets
Add sound of the Roland Rhythm 33/55/330, CR68, CR78, CR8000, TR-505, TR-606, TR-66, TR-55, TR-77, TR-77, TR-707 (Arabic), TR-909, TR-626, TR-727 (Latin), R-70, R-7, R-8 and Boss DR-3, DR-5, DR-110, DR-202, DR-660, DR-770 and DR-880. I am sure this is asking too much but adding some of the sound of these would make it an even greater machine. With a well documented table per button and instruments it should not be too confusing.

[18] Add ability to copy patterns without having to stop the sequencer

[19] Add scatter per instrument
While it is possible to apply effects (Reverb/Delay) per instrument, it is not possible for scatter. (The scatter will beat repeat/reverse only the INST you want i.e. snare and clap only).

[20] Shuffle Modes
It would be nice to hold down TAP and get a few variations in the style of swing/shuffle

[21] Shuffle per instrument
For example, the ability to shuffle only the hats

[22] MIDI channels per pad
Select a different Midi channel (or off) per pad (instrument)

[23] TR-8 as an external controller
It would be nice to program the TR-8 as an external DAW controller, for example with a special power on sequence or key combination. Then to be able to load (via SYSEX) the controller codes for each button, slider and knob. Though, perhaps this would change the TR-8 in something for what it was not made for?

[24] Custom Instrument sounds
To be able to save and load patches and settings of an instrument and then mix different ones to create your own custom drum kit.

[25] No TAP light on external MIDI Clock
When external MIDI clock is used the TAP button does not light up. For example, the TAP could sync to step 1 on the MIDI clock after an external “START” message and then light up for every beat (based on the incoming clocks)

[26] 48HKz selection
Some people report that their DAW in combination with audio card can have issues in Logic. Some people make prefer 48Khz instead of 96Khz.

[27] Update the Manual

The manual is basically one page and characters are so small when printed unable to read. The manual does not include the MIDI implementation and t this information was later on posted separately on the Roland website in the FAQ). Normally Roland does an excellent good for documentation, but somehow for the TR-8 is a very different experience. if you look at the TR-8080 manual, it gives much more detailed explantions how to use the machine, specially for those who just are new to such a device.

P.S: for those that may not know, the TR-8 USB is a true MIDI interface. The data received from the Host is echoed to the MIDI OUT. The MIDI IN sends the data also to the host. In other words, you can use an external MIDI device for sending and receiving MIDI (including SYSEX).

P,S: Note on Volume is always 50, and a note on of 00 when released. it only sends Note on, no notes off.

[28] Linux Audio drivers/support
Please! Please ! Please ! For example Bitwig support Linux and it would be great to have the digital audio connection to the DAW.

[29] 64 step sequence.
Perhaps use A and B buttons in another way
A and B off – sequence 1
A on B off – sequence 2
A off B on - sequence 3
A on B on – Sequence 4

Note: Some of items were taken from various forums and reviews

[daveuu]

Hi Happy,

Sadly I can't grant your wishes but most of them seem doable so I expect future firmware releases to please.

My no. 1 wish is to get MIDI working via ALSA and my no. 2 wish is to get sound working with ALSA. Then I can think about the rest of it . . . (this is your: [28] Linux Audio drivers/support!)

But neither 'amidi -l' nor 'aplay -l' list the TR-8 so I have no JACK access either. But I see you at least have MIDI working and some Roland folk in the UK could see the TR-8 listed as an audio device with 14 INs and 4 OUTs at 96kHz but couldn't record.

My ALSA version is 1.0.27.2, what is yours? I can confirm there is USB contact between the computer and the TR-8 and because it does that weird jumpy tempo thing when its connected and 'lsusb' sees something called 'Roland Corp.' when it is plugged in.

Ultimately a patch can be made and put into this module:

http://lxr.free-electrons.com/source/sound/usb/quirks.c

but I'm still working out how to go about doing that or who to send sniffed USB traffic to that could make that happen (one of the ALSA developers presumably).

As for your feature request: [23] TR-8 as an external controller. This could be achieved by mapping MIDI CCs to different MIDI CC numbers i.e., no configuration required in the TR-8. I recommend MIDIdings for that. You'll need to write a config file but the possibilities for mangling the MIDI data in realtime are endless. I'm not sure about getting the TR-8 to ignore its own knobs and faders and only respond to inputs though (I need to get MIDI working first!)

MIDIdings could also deal with: "Note on Volume is always 50, and a note on of 00 when released. it only sends Note on, no notes off" i.e., convert NoteOn 00 to e.g. NoteOff

So, how did you get MIDI working for ALSA in Linux? (and what is your ALSA version and distro?)

cheers,

Dave

[db Looper]

Hi Again Happy!

You Are SUPER COOL & VERY AWESOME!!! Thank You So Much for compiling this!!!

Here is another feature that would be nice:

Make INST Sound Assignable to Both Assignable A and B Simultaneously

It would be very nice if you could Assign one of the drum INST to Assignable A/B or Both, when using the Assignable Out function found in Various Settings. Currently it's one or the other. I would personally use this to have the INST sound of the TR-8 on one channel via Assignable out A, to still use the wonderful sounds of the -8. And then use the same INST via Assignable out B to trigger an external module(in my case a Jomox MBase), going into another channel. I then change between the channels for different sounds, but all still controlled(mostly) from the TR-8. Hooray!

That's it for now. I still love my -8 and my -3!

-db Looper

[mjames4208]

I only have one wish; and that is to be able to open up the TR-8 as a VST inside my DAW so it can be track assigned and edited easier on a screen instead up using these invisible menus.

[enotide]

I would like to see use of all the sounds, ie Congas and Toms, Claps and Maracas, Rim Shot and Claves, and Cowbell and Ride at the same time in one pattern.

[Happy]

The V 1.10 video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QiqdBbStXnY

Finally some time to write about F/W 1.10 and review all the items once again on this F/W
Splitting the bug and Features request in seperate items Bx and Fx.
Make sure to NOT use use a USB Hub or USB 3.0 Host connection, othweriwse The TR-8 won't work nicely.

For MIDI DIN out test connected with with a Focusrite 18i20 and a DIY (arduino) MIDI interface.
TR8 -> DIN -> DIN/USB => PC
Ubuntu 14.04/Windows 8.1
All tests on Linux except where Windows mentioned.
Linux just works out of the box for TR-8 MIDI , though not for ALSA or Jack audio.
Advanced Linux Sound Architecture Driver Version k3.13.0-36-generic.
Using C++ the Variable ALSA_LIB_VERSION_STRING gives: ALSA library version: 1.0.27.2

FIX REQUESTS (BUGS)

[B1] MIDI Real time messages - not fixed
[B2] Playback random tempo up/down - not fixed
[B3] simple reproduction: play a BD on 1,5,9 and 14 (yes 14), 14 sounds really different with a high decay
[B4] Note-On MIDI implementation - not fixed
[B5] NEW- TR8 USB connected to PC with Win8 Select TR8 both for In and out in MIDI OX. Serup TR8 with CLOCK SOURCE "AUTO" (see manual) Start midiOX. The TR-8 seems to sends a STOP and F8 byte every second. Change TR-8 to "INTERNAL", the "spuriuos" data does not appear
[B6] NEW - SYNC "ECHO" - PC with windows using MIDI-OX, TR-8 connected to USB to the PC only. Start on MIDI-OX an press Transport start. Now TR-8 send on MDI out 48 clocks per quarter note
instead of 24. Perhpas this is the MIDI-OX clock combine with the TR-8 internal clock.
PEr the manual USB should take preferences, it seems not the case.
I would suggest Roland to create an option to disable internal MIDI clock on the TR-8.

[FEATURE REQUEST]

[F1] Scatter does not send CC messages - not implemented
[F2] [External MIDI clock - not 100% impelemented, - When you play something to the TR-8 with a MIDI clock (F8), after the STOP command the TR-8 display will show to the tempo that was send with that previous sequence. Why can't it show it during the playback? Weird.
[F3] Backup/Load Drum patterns. - CLOSED - implemented by USB Storage class (works on Linux too)
[F4] Volume on MIDI message - Not implemented
a . TR-8 send volume 98 on quarter notes and 80 on others
b. The volume slider sends CC but it does not apply this to the velocity Note on message
[F5] ] Instrument mute - not implemented
[F6] External MIDI playback and indicators - not implemente -buttons 1-12 are flashing but no at the spees of incoming notes.Betterwould be to use the instrument buttons instead.
[F7] 14 bit CC resolution - not implemented
[F8] Allow copy pattern from bank A to B and B to A - not implemented
[F9] Enable controller values playback - not implemented -(but you can download the pattern now)
[F10] Increase pattern storage - not implemented
[F11] Save parameters per pattern - You can now download the patterns with TR-8 in storage device mode.
[F12] Add Parameter lock in T-REC mode -
[F13] Add Sound sets Notthing yet... Please CR68 please and able to mix it with other sets
[F14] Add ability to copy patterns without having to stop the sequencer - not implemented
[F15] Add scatter per instrument - not implemented
[F16] Shuffle Modes - not implemented
[F17] Shuffle per instrument - nott implemented
[F18] MIDI channels per pad - not implemented
[F19] TR-8 as an external controller = Implemented in V1.10 (though you cannot select the Controller #)
[F20] Custom Instrument sounds - not implemented it would be great to add these with the USB storage
function or through SYSEX (including a download for the factory presets)
[F21] TAP light on external MIDI Clock - not implmeneted
[F22] 48HKz selection - not implemented
[F23] Update the Manual - not implemented
[F24] Linux Audio drivers/support - not implemented (Jack/ALSA ausio won't work)
[F25] 64 step sequence. - not implemented
[F26] NEW - Able to diasable Midi CLOCK on USB and DIN OUT (also independently) (V.10 only adds a function to ingnore INCOMING Clock)
[F27] Add MMC command to start stop an externnal sequencer
[F28] Make INST Sound Assignable to Both Assignable A and B Simultaneously
[F29] To be able to open up the TR-8 as a VST inside my DAW so it can be track assigned and edited easier on a screen instead up using these invisible menus. (there is a roland tools here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5nEqsEsLRM
[F30] Use of all the sounds, ie Congas and Toms, Claps and Maracas, Rim Shot and Claves, and Cowbell and Ride at the same time in one pattern.
[F31]Do not want the TR8 to play one of its internal loops when I press start on external device. (ext MIDI)
Possible in V1.10 (but is still sends CLOCK on MIDI DIN)

F28..F31 were taken from this forum and/or other threads.

That's it. Hopefully Roland will work on a V1.20

My personal wish for CR68/78. (free of charge :-)) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJmJ9oQXObk

[Amni]

I love the TR8 but cant stand the fact that the Open HiHat cuts out if the closed hihait is running all pads.

Also would be great if it had trigs like the Elektrons.

[NeonHorn]

My one BIG request in the TR-8 is the ability to lock a kit to a pattern (like you can lock a sound to a pattern on the TB-3). Perform live I wouldn't want to have to manually load up the 808 sounds when I'm switching from a techno track to an acid house track.
If you could lock the kit to the pattern, it would be a huge help for performing livePA.
I think this should be doable.
Let me know your thoughts.
Many thanks,
Mike

[rookyandb]

I have 1 main request feature, to be able to run/play both a and b tracks at the same time (unison mode). From what I've researched this isn't an option. I'd like to be able to layer my 808 with 909 bass drums, plus it would allow for a more unique layout of instruments, effectively giving you 22 total, for a single pattern. It might also fix Amni's issue at the same time.

[SonicRevolutions]

Here's another one:

Restart from first pattern when multiple patterns are selected to play (start instead of continue)

[SonicRevolutions]

Btw you can get the TR-8 to use 48khz sample rate. Just create an aggregated device with your soundcard and set its clock to 48khz. The TR-8 will simply adapt to your soundcard's clock.

[Happy]

Another option for 48/24Khz. It seems you can route the TR8 USB to an MX1 and from there get 24/48/96 to the DAW over USB. Yup, a little bit expensive, but you get an extra toy to play with.

On another note Its is kind of weird that on NAMM they keep saying the MX-1 does not support USB MIDI class compliant while the TR8 does work fine as a MIDI device under Ubuntu (no drivers). Perhaps they mean the MX1 not being standard USB audio device class compliant. Indeed with Jack2 it fails to start but it is detected as an Audio device in Ubuntu. Likely, it may just need a little tweak in the Linux Kernel to get it to work. Perhaps kernel 3.19 which is said to have better support for audio.

[Synthtron]

I would like to be able to trigger separate patterns via MIDI or can you do that already??? Hmmm.

[StefYver]

Btw you can get the TR-8 to use 48khz sample rate. Just create an aggregated device with your soundcard and set its clock to 48khz. The TR-8 will simply adapt to your soundcard's clock.

Tried this and it worked for a day.

Then I stopped my Mac and restarted the next day and the TR-8 in my aggregate device was set back to 96k Kz.

Anyone else has this problem ?

[zedius]

[F32] Allow reverb and delay effects to affect the external audio input.

I brought my TR-8 to a jam with my minibrute thinking I could apply its reverb and delay effects to the minibrute signal instead of bringing a separate effects box. Unfortunately, the minibrute going into the TR-8 was not affected by the TR-8's effects. If it's possible to change this so that the TR-8 effects are in line with the audio inputs, that would be quite handy.