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Here's the last REAL HIPHOP/Neosoul track I composed on the roland - disregard the wack freestyle - a trademark of all my initial mixes......

use this link and when the yahoo page can't be displayed page comes up, delete the 'http://' and press enter.....

http://www.geocities.com/the_magnificen ... gedemo.mp3


I did it - brought back my Fantom X88 and got...yes - the motif es 88 - a major increason on the old motif - And I think better synth than the fantom-x - I also got the 01x mixer and I"m not oh sooooooooo easily routing 16 mo es audio intruement tracks in to... GET THIS..Separate tracks of cubase. It Even has a cubase patch script and just when you thought yamy didn't have the crazy sounds roland has...Guess again.. the bases are every bit as expolsive as ar the leads. Don't get me started on the guitar arps. AND just when I was getting used to the fantom to. Well, I'm not abandoning roland totally, but in my opintion yamaha stuck to what it needed to, letting software give us the visual control of sequencing we need via software WITH EASE, I can use my friggin mo es's jog wheel to scrool though my arrange in cubase. All the virtual instrument parameter's in cubase can be controlled via motif with ease. And now, I'm routing ALL my intruments to separate mide AND AUDIO tracks which makes mixdown painless - and through ONE STINKIN MLAN CORD!!!! - That is revolutionary, as is Fantom x's interface, but the sound of the end product is what counts. Making sampling look good and isn't enough - Gimmie ALL MY OUTPUTS IN ONE CORD ROLAND. SO I DON"T HAVE TO KEEP MUTING TRACKS AND PLAYING THEM BACK TO MIX ALL OF THEM - Yamaha is also more Composer friendly - It caters to those truly intrested it building a mix of instruments and making a composition. Roland is going hollywood on us - fancy shmansy sampling. Which is cool - but try picking your favorite distorted guitar from patch mode and placing it in a performance - hmm a lil crappy sounding huh - that's cause the PATCH probably used 3 awsome FX - YOUR FREAKIN MAX IN PERFORMANCE MODE!!!!!!!! - Better hope the other instruments your performance uses need distortion to. You have to be really STINGY with FX on the roland with those 3 perf FX, which can leave your other instruments sounding like pure sh.. - I don't care what anyone says, it aint fun when going back into patch mode and recording 1 track at a time to take advantage of the fantom x's FX - The yamaha mo es is much better, allowing for 8 channels of fx while which is a much better spread. I'm composing neo soul quickly now - and having FUUUUUUUN again. - Now when Roland addresses these things, I'll be back - PS - VARIOS IMPRESSES THE HELL OUT OF ME AND I WILL BE GETTING THAT.

This is why I too have decided not to get a Fantom-X. To use a baseball analogy, in my opinion Roland hit a home run with the user interface, but only a single with the specifications compared to the competition (e.g. less ROM, effects, arpeggiations, alternative synthesis types, etc.). The only reason I'm posting this is I hope some Roland rep that is lurking on this forum will read this and pass the word that Roland really needs to step up to the plate and provide a workstation that will *leap frog* the competition, not just try (and fail) to play catch-up.

Hey swandiver: I have to agree with you with most of the things you have to say about Roland VS the competition, except for one thing: the "less ROM" argument.

IMO, if Roland shines in a department, it's this one. Ok, it comes with only 128, but fully expanded, you triple that. Then, no other workstation comes even close. You might say "expensive", and I would agree, but when you say "less ROM", it's just doesn't make sense.

I'm planning to buy a XR, and this is one of the major selling points for me. Maybe a ES Rack with 195 mb would be great, but you just add two cards in the XR and you beat it so...

You know, I've thought about all the things that c0p' said before. But then the answer ALWAYS comes out the same: It's not WHAT you have, how MUCH of what you have, or even how much of what you DON'T have. Let me speak with you all for just a moment.


I grew up knowing a friend who didn't have much money but was AGRESSIVELY attempting to become good at music production. Fairly poor, and too young to really get a job, legally that is. This man worked with some really crappy equipment, (his keyboard being a Casio 310) and he slowly progressed to DAWs.

He's an engineer now. And he has some really outstanding music under his belt -- because he learned to work AROUND these constant problems. He didn't have 128 voices of polyphony. He BARELY had MIDI. He took what he had and didn't complain about it. Sure it was a pain, and alot of the time he wished he could sound better, but if he never endured any of that hardship, he would have probably never built the dedication he has today.

I'm not trying to put anyone down, or say anything negative here, I'm just saying: Be thankful for what you have. I worked off of a Roland XP60 for the last 6 years. I used programs to make up for what the keyboard was lacking.

It all depends on the user. I still say the Fantom X6 is the best buy right now, just because of the user Friendliness. I can get around EVERY single problem you all have mentioned so far (except for customer service, of course) with either Samplitude, Cubase, Reason, Acid, Fruity Loops -- Whatever program!

Only 3 MFX? I can deal with that. No problem. Need those Midi Outs to work properly. I do hand it to you, the Mixer/Cubase setup is time saving, and graceful. No denying it.

Again.. Different applications / different people. I spent 6 years doing it the long way, and I still have managed to produce over 700 tracks. I hope you all find what works best for you as well.


Best Regaurds,

Saki XL
Instrumentally Sick Productions



Good Work, Soldier!
"...Boku no kore wa tatakai desu..."

Definitely be thenkful for what you have - But just make sure what you have WORKS is the best you can get for what you want to do. In my case, the mo es definitely is.

sur ethe roland is user friendly. That's is main selling point - The motif es's selling point is SOUND - and OPTIONS so make your SOUND BETTER, FASTER. SOUNDS to me like Yamaha stuck to the main OBJECTIVE - MUSIC. YA it doesn't have a MICROSOFT looking interface - SO WHAT, The sounds are immaculate, and yamaha concentrated on bring the sound out, not the screen resolution. AND my workflow is NOW AMAZING - 16 audio Separate audio ins via m-lan! Hell, now I get my vst effects and use them to make my music mix sound good before even laying the damn tracks - (VIA REVERB ETC. how many outs does your Roland have? - hmm. How well is your roland designed to control software - Don't even say anything, because Yamaha built the mo es with the mackie contol protocol! UMM YAAAAAAA.

Here's what the fantom series is... these fantom boards all like the now crumpled, dog eared, papers you wrote years ago that you typed up and printed on a new sheet of 8.5 by 11. Recycled xv sounds presented nicely. Not to say those old xv sounds aren't any good though, they're great, but nothing new. yamy has a new sound engine - and mlan is a TOTALLY NEW protocol wisely EMBRACED BY KORG AND KURZ mith more on the way. I now know why they've embraced this mlan technology, And I'm now EXTREMELY THANKFUL

Hey Guys,

Much passion about these workstations fer sure but I must say (I think I can b/c I own both the ES8 and the X6) that both machines are great at certain things and not so great at others. I couldn't imagine not having both in what I do. The ES sounds are incredible..believible, In fact, the first demo I did (with the Hootie and the Blowfish guys) fooled alot of people into thinking the electric gtrs were real...as well as the drums..the drums sound better on the ES, that is, if you want clean, realistic drums...The sequencer does work great once you get the hang of it and is more traditional in approach and flow...HOWEVER, the sampling on the ES is stupid. It's not easy to do and not intuitive...which makes it not very usable to me...the X6 is great at sampling, simple. great interface, yes, but also pratical and usuable quickly and does not hamper the creative process. also, the Piano is good, and the hip hop, low fi resample, kinda drum things can't be beat (outside of an MPC)...I use both machines together and they compiment one another well..I know having both is not an option for everyone, but each machine works better than the other depending on who you are and what kind of muic you are making....I guess I'm trying to say...can't we all just get along...

Bc



...Carry on, Sweet Southern Comfort....

"I guess I'm trying to say...can't we all just get along..."

Apparently NOT.

I guess I'm on the other end of the spectrum as I dumped my 2 Yamaha Motif's for Roland Gear. I hated the bright Motif synth sounds, ISS, and the inability to really get down and program your own arps. Then again, I'm into electronica and you don't see many electronic music acts using any modern Yamaha gear. The Motif's aren't selling well in England.

I'm also into Jazz though and for that the Motif was great. So I do intend to either pick up a Motif ES rack (Hopeing they get the timeing problems squared away) or a 61key S90ES for the Jazz application. I guess we'll see what goes down at Summer NAMM.

Different strokes for different folks.

OH...and BTW, the Korg Triton Extreme, Kurzweil K2661, and Kuzweil PC1X, aren't fitted for the MLAN option. The latest products from these companies.

Current Synth Kit List: (Provided to help with questions)
Roland Fantom X6
Clavia Nord Lead 2X
Clavia Nord Modular G2 Engine
Access Virus C
Novation D-Station
Korg Legacy Collection

M-Lan is impressive. Always thought it'd work really well if I had to use it, and again - for workflow purposes, it really gets the job done.


But as Muzik said "Different strokes for different folks". If I weren't buying new furniture for my house or something, I might consider getting the Motif ES - but since I need the cash, I'm just waiting to see if they decide to release the ES Rack or something to the like.




Saki XL
Instrumentally Sick EVOLUTION
______________________

Good Work, Soldier!
"...Boku no kore wa tatakai desu..."

I own the S88,use a borrowed Motif rack,and recently bought the Motif ES 6.
I still prefer the S/X8 keyboard feel over the Motif ES8 or Korg.
Other than that IMHO either a combo of the S or X Roland with the Motif rack or ES series is a great way to have the best of both worlds.
If I see a deal on the XR I might add it for those new features and six expansion board slots.
But it is all subjective and task specific in what you plan to do with it.
I'll add a Dave Smith Polyvolver or vintage analog synth software eventually.
I practice piano using the S88 with the SRX-02 and the ES6 pianos with the S88 as controller and use the ES6 for arps and all it's many great features etc.
Korg will eventually offer a flagship upgrade to the Triton series and hopefully a module version.
Owning the ES6 makes me less intimidated about the Yammy navigation and OS but the Fantom S/X interface is a NO BRAINER!

It's all GOOD!

Peace,
Tony

hey art,

u didn't post a single message here? that means i guess the first guy is right. what's ur comments. i am always eager to hear stuff from yoall peepul.

and by the way, the best way to start a music career is to either buy a low-pro gadjet or a high-tech wonder - like start with a TRITON Le or with a FX or ES.

dont start with something middle of these too like the Motif, TRITON or FS.

they wont qualify you for the humble story that Saki told us about.

Sambasevam.S

The best way to start a music career is to learn music.

In Mexico we have a saying: "El que es perico, donde quiera es verde," meaning something like "if you're a parrot, you're green no matter where you are," meaning if you're good, you're good regardless of the conditions. Give a creative composer/arranger/producer a 1988 Casiotone and he/she'll come up with something good.

If you spend too much of your time dealing with your gear, you won't have much time left to create. Also remember, owning a Formula 1 doesn't make you Fittipaldi.

So I agree with Mucsusn. Your musical talent and creativity are 80% of the mix. I'll leave 20% to the gear, and I'm being generous.

Peace.

M

Exactly the point I was getting at, guys.


I don't care about the gear as much as most other people do. I care to a point, but that's because I'm just like the guy I told you about -- I don't have alot. Well, now that I'm military that's of course changed, but... Heh. I still got my point across to someone. Hey, that's happening alot lately.. Mada mada shinde iru.


Best Regaurds,

Saki XL
Instrumentally Sick EVOLUTION

Good Work, Soldier!
"...Boku no kore wa tatakai desu..."

anythin u say ;-I


Sambasevam.S